Wooing that opposite gender ;)

Friendly, spirited debates please people! Keep it clean.
User avatar
cezen
Elf
Posts: 599
Joined: Wed Jun 18, 2008 8:59 pm
Gender: Male
Status: Offline

Wooing that opposite gender ;)

Postby cezen » Wed Jun 22, 2011 9:46 pm

Since I'm currently bored with the threads here, I decided to make this one.
Or maybe I'm looking for tips? Lol who knows.

Anyway, hopefully this will be benificial to everyone for when they decide to get off the internet and tackle that crush. Or tackle that one on the internet. Get feedback from both genders point of views.
Get ready to start wooing people!

I'll start things off with a quote from one of my favorite books(The Wise Man's Fear):

"There is something ephemeral in the air," Elodin said, moving to stand behind Fela. He puts his hands on her shoulders, leaning close to her ears. "She loves the lines of him," he said softly. "She is curious about the shape of his mouth. She wonders if this could be the one, if she could unclasp the secret pieces of her heart to him." Fela looked down, her cheeks flushing a bright scarlet. Elodin stalked around to stand behind me. "Kvothe looks at her, and for the first time he understands the impulse that first drove men to paint. To sculpt. To sing."
He circled us again, eventually standing between us like a priest about to perform a wedding. "There exists between them something tenuous and delicate. They can both feel it. Like static in the air. Faint as frost."
He looked me full in the face. His dark eyes serious. "Now. What do you do?"
I looked back at him, utterly lost. If there was one thing I knew less about than naming, it was courting women.
"There are three paths here," Elodin said to the class. He held up one finger. "First. Our young lovers can try to express what they feel. They can try to play the half-heard song their hearts are singing."
Elodin paused for effect. "This is the path of the honest fool, and it will go badly. This thing between you is too tremulous for talk. It is a spark so faint that even the most careful breath might snuff it out."
Master Namer shook his head. "Even if you are clever and have a way with words, you are doomed in this. Because while your mouths might speak the same language, your hearts do not." He looked at me intently. "This is an issue of translation."
Elodin held up two fingers. "The second path is more careful. You talk of small things. The weather. A familiar play. You spend time in company. You hold hands. In doing so you slowly learn the secret meanings of each other's words. This way, when the time comes you can speak with subtle meaning underneath your words, so there is understanding on both sides."
Elodin made a sweeping gesture toward me. "Then there is the third path. The path of Kvothe." He strode to stand shoulder to shoulder with me, facing Fela. "You sense something between you. Something wonderful and delicate."
He gave a romantic, lovelorn sigh. "And, because you desire certainty in all things, you decide to force the issue. You take the shortest route. Simplest is best, you think." Elodin extended his own hands and made wild grasping motions in Fela's direction. "So you reach out and you grab this young woman's breasts."


--Rothfuss 230-231

If you are too lazy to read, let me sum it up for you.
The best way(or at least starting procedure) to woo your crush/love/whatever is to get to know him or her, and start spending more time with them. Get to know the little things about them. In the process, you'll find out whether you truly like them. If you do, you'll come to appreciate them for more than their looks - which is generally what initially attracted you to them in the first place.

Does anyone disagree? Or have any input?

Of course, there's also the forward method of straight grabbing "this young woman's breasts". But lol, that probably only works if you've gotten them drunk first and are pretty attractive physically and personality wise. Even then, you'd probably have to get to know them a little bit first. I don't suggest this method, unless you're a desperate fratstar. (This is directed at college kids/party kids) It makes you look bad.

The point is you probably shouldn't be too forward. Personally, there was a girl that liked me last school year that I didnt like. Her close friends were in my dorm. Their rooms were right near mine, a door away on the opposite side of the hall. I remember she came and knocked on my door once. "Hello CezeN!" "Hey ____, what's up?" "I was just in the neighborhood and wanted to stop by. Blablabla small talk. Blablabla. Well, just wanted to let you know I'm gonna be studying in the kitchen over there! Bye!" "Bye"
My roomate gave me his patented headbob seizure nod to show that he thinks someone likes someone.
I laughed.

And then, there was this college event that the indian organizations of my University threw called Diwuli, which celebrates the Indian New Year, in the second-to-tallest hotel skyscraper in the western hemisphere. I went to it with friends. This girl, who is Indian, went to it. Sometime near the end of the night, we were talking and she manuevered the conversation into asking if I like indian girls. Wow.

Forward method, for both genders, only works if the person you're being forward too finds you extremely attractive. I think.

If you think you have some advice or issues worth discussing, please post it. =D
Truth is: Texas sucks.

How is Gunny feeling on First Earth?
Image

User avatar
Antilles
Rolling Thunder
Posts: 880
Joined: Wed Sep 17, 2008 5:46 pm
Real First Name: Mohammad
Location: The Motor City
Gender: Male
Status: Offline

Re: Wooing that opposite gender ;)

Postby Antilles » Wed Jun 22, 2011 11:18 pm

Don't have a girlfriend, never have. I tried route 2 once because I thought it seemed the best way to go about it while things were still unsure, and landed square in the Friend Zone. Route 3 doesn't fit me at all, and Route 1 only works if you have all the luck o' the Irish. Your mileage may vary, though.

In short, I suck at this, and have no valuable input.
"oh sharkie is so evul" -sharkie
"Oh sure, ANTILLES gets love and hugs and confetti. What do I get? The halfway empty coffee carafe...and someone left the creamer out...it has lumps in it. I hate you all." -IzzyTehMuze
"OMGWOOT I COULD FEED 33 HUNGRY WEASELS" -Nick

User avatar
Sorcha
Commander
Posts: 1337
Joined: Wed Jun 14, 2006 11:31 pm
Location: Your imagination
Gender: Female
Status: Offline

Re: Wooing that opposite gender ;)

Postby Sorcha » Wed Jun 22, 2011 11:30 pm

Yeah the best way is to get to know them before trying anything (so you know what you're potentially getting into). I think the forward way does work for some people; a very particular type of person but not to the point of going around groping people :P.

I've only been in the one relationship, and I've known him since I was a kid. We only got to the talking/getting to know each other stage after literally years of ignoring each other with the occassional insult thrown in (that's another thing, apparently if you like someone you let them know by being as mean to them as possible?)
Image

raped by immortal and then sprinkled with love from kitty (:
you dare rape my sig?! o: i'ma gonna find out who did that. *kidnaps sig*

*raped with kisses and love from kitty again* ;)

User avatar
Lime Yay
Ten o' clock
Posts: 1329
Joined: Fri Aug 18, 2006 3:27 am
Location: The Mitten of America
Status: Offline

Re: Wooing that opposite gender ;)

Postby Lime Yay » Thu Jun 23, 2011 12:57 am

So being forward as a man means molesting women, and being forward as a woman means making small talk at every given opportunity? Lol. If you think it's too forward for a woman to initiate conversation, how would you feel if she grabbed your crotch?

Honestly, I don't think groping a woman can ever work. I mean, I suppose maybe you could date in spite of this, but never because of it. I'm not saying that she'll think you're disgusting, but if she appreciates it, it's because she thinks of you as a sex object, too.

I have a boyfriend. I feel like maybe I could give advice, but I have a friend who has only been on the dates I've set her up on, and never a boyfriend. If I could give good advice, she wouldn't be single right now. I fail as a mentor.
Image
Thanks to Diana for the sweetest (erm... sourest?) signature ever!

User avatar
cezen
Elf
Posts: 599
Joined: Wed Jun 18, 2008 8:59 pm
Gender: Male
Status: Offline

Re: Wooing that opposite gender ;)

Postby cezen » Thu Jun 23, 2011 1:27 am

Lime Yay wrote:So being forward as a man means molesting women, and being forward as a woman means making small talk at every given opportunity? Lol. If you think it's too forward for a woman to initiate conversation, how would you feel if she grabbed your crotch?

Honestly, I don't think groping a woman can ever work. I mean, I suppose maybe you could date in spite of this, but never because of it. I'm not saying that she'll think you're disgusting, but if she appreciates it, it's because she thinks of you as a sex object, too.

I have a boyfriend. I feel like maybe I could give advice, but I have a friend who has only been on the dates I've set her up on, and never a boyfriend. If I could give good advice, she wouldn't be single right now. I fail as a mentor.

You misunderstand me Lime. Mostly because you weren't there in any of the situations.

She was being too forward in the sense she was making it too obvious that she likes me. Generally, you take things slow and glide through the water slowly in order to make sure the other person likes you, before you do such overt flirting as asking "Do you like girls of my race?" or starting a conversation just to awkwardly tell me you're gonna be somewhere near me. This is a face-saving technique so that one person doesn't have to simply break the other's heart - instead the person who likes the other gets a feel for how the other person feels and whether being forward will result in a rejection and then possibly an awkward relationship - or a reciprocation.

In that same sense, if a man simply just started grabbing a girl - this brings the outcomes of him being outright rejected and their relationship changing - or her grabbing the guy back. Either way, it's not a smart gambit.

My point is you shouldn't do either without going through path 2 and getting an inkling that the person likes you back. That's the point when you act forward and make a move.
Truth is: Texas sucks.

How is Gunny feeling on First Earth?
Image

User avatar
cezen
Elf
Posts: 599
Joined: Wed Jun 18, 2008 8:59 pm
Gender: Male
Status: Offline

Re: Wooing that opposite gender ;)

Postby cezen » Thu Jun 23, 2011 2:18 am

Antilles wrote:Don't have a girlfriend, never have. I tried route 2 once because I thought it seemed the best way to go about it while things were still unsure, and landed square in the Friend Zone. Route 3 doesn't fit me at all, and Route 1 only works if you have all the luck o' the Irish. Your mileage may vary, though.

In short, I suck at this, and have no valuable input.

That's the thing about Route 2. In the quote I posted, it was the relationship between two people in love.

In real life, you don't know if the person your getting to know actually likes you significantly. And thus, it may lead to you finding out they don't - and it'll lead to a friendship.

Personally, I did path 2 with the girl I liked the most last school year. And after a month, I got friend zoned (officialy). Of course, I'm not sure if its because the girl really only liked me as a friend or because she'd gotten back with her boyfriend. So - currently biding my time to give it another shot later in these four college years.

But yeah, it happens to alot of us.

Sorcha wrote:Yeah the best way is to get to know them before trying anything (so you know what you're potentially getting into). I think the forward way does work for some people; a very particular type of person but not to the point of going around groping people :P.

I've only been in the one relationship, and I've known him since I was a kid. We only got to the talking/getting to know each other stage after literally years of ignoring each other with the occassional insult thrown in (that's another thing, apparently if you like someone you let them know by being as mean to them as possible?)

I agree. The forward way works with certain people. Sororistutes for example. (College term combining sorority sister and prostitute) Fratbros.

For example, one of my good friends, who is female, is very sexual. I remember hearing a story in our friend group about how one of her icebreakers early in the freshman year when they were hanging a Saturday Night, before we knew each other that well, involved demonstrating sex positions on each of them.

Man, I remember I helped her concoct a plan to get back at a guy for something by seducing him into taking her to his Fraternity Formal. And then, making out with alot of his fratbrothers - while refusing him. And then - despite the fact fratformalcouples sleep in the same bed - ultimately not sleeping with him. She did it...Yeah, I am horrible amiriite?

I'm pretty sure if I straight grabbed her tits, she wouldn't be displeased, especially considering all the times she's groped me and the inuendos. She'd probably bust a condom out of her bra - and we'd evolve to the friends with benifits.

So yes, that technique can work. Though, I'm not really talking about love, but sexual attraction.

Last, yes being mean is a tale-tell way of someone showing they like you. By picking on you. Usually this is like an elementary-middleschool thing. I still do it, but in a more joking manner.

Me: Yo, Somalian/Arabic girl - translate some of this song for me.
Girl: lmao, i love this song! butttt...i can't help you. pwahaha!
Me: ....What are you good for?
Girl: i know you don't mean that. XD
Truth is: Texas sucks.

How is Gunny feeling on First Earth?
Image

User avatar
Kitsy
Fufububbles
Fufububbles
Posts: 6887
Joined: Sat Apr 01, 2006 7:57 pm
Real First Name: Katarina
Location: The land of Kitty (: aka. London
Gender: Female
Status: Offline

Re: Wooing that opposite gender ;)

Postby Kitsy » Thu Jun 23, 2011 2:13 pm

Tbh, I would've done the same as what that girl did to you cezen, but I'm an absolute flirt and I have no shame. :P You don't need to know someone likes you to flirt with them, that's the whole point of flirting - to figure out if they do! So she flirts, you don't flirt back and she can back off without being too embarassed, end of story.

I don't know, I guess it really depends on the type of girl and guy involved. I'm really forward, so I like guys that are forward too, but then I know a few girls that would be quite intimidated by overly forward men. The "get to know them approach" does work best, but you've got to slip in a substantial amount of flirting in there otherwise you'll go straight into the friend zone. There's got to be a bit of laughing, sexual innuendos, lightly touching their arm when you talk or linking arms with them in a joking way.
I'm just sort of rambling now. Do you guys (and girls) agree? Both genders, what would you find most attractive if someone was coming onto you? A forward guy/girl, or someone who was more reserved? I find guys who hold back frustrating, but that's my personal preference. And flirting is definately the way forward into any sort of relationship - even if it's just a friends with benefits one.
Image
Silly little foul black twisted heart I am!
http://superkits.tumblr.com

User avatar
cezen
Elf
Posts: 599
Joined: Wed Jun 18, 2008 8:59 pm
Gender: Male
Status: Offline

Re: Wooing that opposite gender ;)

Postby cezen » Thu Jun 23, 2011 10:41 pm

Maybe it's just me, but I consider flirting a subtle art.
On the otherhand, I coined the term failflirting to describe what the girl was doing.

I mean, there's a difference between flirting with someone...and simply making it obvious you like someone. One is more forward than the other. However, like you said, actually flirting is a way to test out the waters(whether they'll flirt back and such) while giving you a chance to save face. What she was doing was the equivalent of simply saying "I like you! <3" and awkwardly putting someone on the spot.

Personally, maybe that's because I'm a more reserved guy. I'd like a girl who would throw in some subtle flirtation, but move more slowly at a get to know pace. For example, this girl I'm currently pulling (not to be confused with wooing, but I'm doing that too) let me know she was attracted to me more from her facial expressions. Like, an uncontrollable smile in my presence. Oh, and laughing at alot of my jokes. Then we found out our favorite rap artists was the same. Had something significant in common. Started texting. Started hanging out at key times, for example when my school threw concerts. When our school had a ball. I needed a dance partner for my social dance class, she wanted to learn formal dances, so I invited her. Second to last day of the college semester, we hung out. Went out to eat. Came back and she helped me pack and cleaned my room like a wife and we talked. I helped her carry her stuff when she was leaving.
This was over the course of 4 months. Now we're talking over Facebook(this is the same girl from the facebook conversation I posted in my last post), and its to the point we have a nosy mutual friend saying
" i think you guys secretly (or not so since im posting this) love each other lol"

Then again, I'm only taking it so slowly with this girl because she's a runnerup to the girl I like the most, who's above every other girl I know - who Im trying to get over. So yeah, I'm a more slow, reserved guy. But not like 5 months slow.
-------------------------------------------------------------------------------------------------------------------
But yeah Kitsy, during the get-to-know phase - you have to flirt a little. You have to - what we call- spit game.
UrbanDictionary
1. To use charm, wit, humor, or other means to verbally let a female know that you are interested in her.
3. Meaning trying to "win"/flirt over ones attention or trying to get to know one better intimately,being attracted to one and try to let them know that.

You have to try to make the person laugh. Get them to like you, through the way you behave or your personality or whatever.

Last remark:
A forward guy that a girl's not physically attracted to is called creepy.
A forward guy that a girl is a attracted to is called flirtatious.
The same can be said for girls, but with different terms.

I don't know, I feel like being forward only works if the person you're being forward to is also a forward person - or if they're already really attracted to you.
Truth is: Texas sucks.

How is Gunny feeling on First Earth?
Image

User avatar
cezen
Elf
Posts: 599
Joined: Wed Jun 18, 2008 8:59 pm
Gender: Male
Status: Offline

Re: Wooing that opposite gender ;)

Postby cezen » Thu Jun 30, 2011 1:24 am

Bump

Here are Some related Cracked articles I've run across in the past:
http://www.cracked.com/article/206_6-wa ... ct-ladies/

http://www.cracked.com/article_18440_6- ... n-off.html

http://www.cracked.com/article_18866_5- ... ience.html

http://www.cracked.com/article_19024_6- ... -with.html

I think the most significant thing I picked up out of all these was that you should lightly touch a woman on the arm if you're gonna ask her to dance at a party, or get a phone number, when you're first trying to get her attention. I think my "yes"/"sure"s might have went up after I started doing that.

I think the whole "ignore someone to attract them" thing doesn't work. Lol I kinda ignored this really attractive girl during the whole year, more because I was intimidated by how attractive she was, and I'm pretty sure that didn't woo her.

Last, it's probably true that women like good dancers, but I did actually woo a girl by being a bad dancer. You can woo people with random things, I swear.

The story goes: Back when I had no experience dancing at all, near the beginning of my Freshman year(sometime in October 2010, maybe) I went to a fratparty with some friends. Danced for maybe the first time. This decently attractive asian girl asked me if I wanted to dance. I said "sure, eh how do I dance?" "just move your hips from side to side"
I don't know how you guys dance at parties in Europe and Australia, but in America it's mostly just bumping and grinding unless you're dancing with your friends. As easy as that is to do, I didn't know how to do it.

Skipping the rest of the story:
11:25:01 PM 5/5/2011
Oh yeah, one of the mysteries of my freshman year. If you remember, I told you a story of how I suck at dancing and a girl asked me to dance for the first time, and you said you heard the same from Kristen ____. What exactly did she say about me? Please tell lol!

11:29:04 PM 5/5/2011
Haha, how'd you randomly think about that now? Lol. Idk, i dont remember exactly what she said, i think we were talking about the type of guys we like, and she mentioned that she likes black guys that cant really dance. and then she said she went to a frat party and danced with some guy like that : P


I guess my question I have for any girls that pass through this thread, what do you think of guys that can't dance that good? lol
Truth is: Texas sucks.

How is Gunny feeling on First Earth?
Image

User avatar
Sorcha
Commander
Posts: 1337
Joined: Wed Jun 14, 2006 11:31 pm
Location: Your imagination
Gender: Female
Status: Offline

Re: Wooing that opposite gender ;)

Postby Sorcha » Thu Jun 30, 2011 8:46 am

I don't really have the time to read those articles right now, but just in answer to your question, personally if the guy can dance (like, properly none of this weird grinding business) then that's a bonus. It's not a deal breaker or anything though. I mean it can be adorable when they can't (my boyfriend can't really dance but I still love him to bits).
Image

raped by immortal and then sprinkled with love from kitty (:
you dare rape my sig?! o: i'ma gonna find out who did that. *kidnaps sig*

*raped with kisses and love from kitty again* ;)

User avatar
Lime Yay
Ten o' clock
Posts: 1329
Joined: Fri Aug 18, 2006 3:27 am
Location: The Mitten of America
Status: Offline

Re: Wooing that opposite gender ;)

Postby Lime Yay » Sat Jul 09, 2011 5:11 pm

I agree with Kitsy, I would talk to the guy I like. What else can a woman do to improve her chances? Men pick and choose what women they want, and women only say yes or no. That's so inefficient. And, if I was studying in a hall with people I knew I would feel OBLIGATED to invite them along, actually. Are you sure she liked you? And just because you knew does that mean she was throwing herself at you? How can people ever date if they're not sure if the other likes them? A complete shot in the dark? When my boyfriend and I started dating, we knew we liked each other. Everyone else knew it, too.

As you said, ignoring someone you like does not work.
Image
Thanks to Diana for the sweetest (erm... sourest?) signature ever!

User avatar
cezen
Elf
Posts: 599
Joined: Wed Jun 18, 2008 8:59 pm
Gender: Male
Status: Offline

Re: Wooing that opposite gender ;)

Postby cezen » Sat Jul 09, 2011 8:59 pm

Lime Yay wrote:I agree with Kitsy, I would talk to the guy I like. What else can a woman do to improve her chances? Men pick and choose what women they want, and women only say yes or no. That's so inefficient. And, if I was studying in a hall with people I knew I would feel OBLIGATED to invite them along, actually. Are you sure she liked you? And just because you knew does that mean she was throwing herself at you? How can people ever date if they're not sure if the other likes them? A complete shot in the dark? When my boyfriend and I started dating, we knew we liked each other. Everyone else knew it, too.

As you said, ignoring someone you like does not work.

Kitsy wasn't talking about simply talking to the guy...but being super flirtatious. That reminds me Kitsy, shameless flirts flirt with everyone of the opposite gender?

Also, I don't know if you're "men pick and choose" sentence was your implied interpretation of how you think I'm saying it should work. But, women can do the same thing. Though, it seems women tend to wait for men to make the move. Regardless of who's making the moves, the same "strategies" apply. As Kitsy basically said, the forward way works on a forward person. It probably won't work on a more reserved person. Also once the person doesn't initially flirt back, you should probably change tact and back off a little. Just Sayin.

And, since you're just reading my translation of the situation, and didn't actually percieve it yourself, just trust me instead of trying to find flaws or other possibilities in my translation. If I say with a girl likes me, then she probably does. I'm not one of those cocky guys who says that about everyone woman that breaths. ('-' ) Which reminds me. I remember I was talking to a friend, and I told her a girl liked me. She then saw me talking with the girl, for like a second. The next time she saw me "CezeN you were right. That girl is soooo into you. I have to admit, I thought you were just being cocky..." "How could you tell?" "Blablablabla she's using her flirty voice"
You remind me of this friend.

But no, she wasn't throwing herself at me. But that's just the extreme. She was being overly forward. Think of it like a dance. You can stumble and stomp around heavily. Or you can have light feet. One implies rhythym and skill, the other implies fail.

They can date by first spending time together and getting to know each other and becoming friends first, while throwing in some subtle flirtation. After a certain point, someone will analyze the relationship and make a move - or maybe they'll find out they don't like each other that much, and that they should be good friends. This is path number 2 from the original post.
Truth is: Texas sucks.

How is Gunny feeling on First Earth?
Image


Return to “The Debate Forum”

Who is online

Users browsing this forum: No registered users and 3 guests

Artemis Fowl Confidential Fan Forum : Disclaimer
cron

Login  •  Register